Speaker 0 00:04 Hi and welcome to. That makes total sense. The podcast where we talk about faith, finance and everyday life in a way that makes total sense. I'm your host Alexis city. On this podcast, you'll hear the personal stories of friends I'll be interviewing who are doing familiar things in new and innovative ways. We'll answer questions specifically about money and our relationship with it and we'll explore faith and Bible teaching together in all of these. It's not about changing our convictions as much as it is about messing with our methods. We'll have a lot of moments here together where we pause and say, that makes total sense.
Speaker 0 00:44 Hi, I'm Alexis <inaudible> and welcome to that makes total sense. Today we have worship leader and teacher Brandon Roberson on the show. I met Brandon just a few months ago through Paul Wilbur actually. He was playing keys for Paul and really leading worship with him in such a beautiful and magnificent way and Brandon and I thankfully were able to connect and I just knew that I had to have him on the show. At that point. I had no idea really why or what we were going to talk about, but I really just feel like our conversation today was led by the Holy spirit. So we cover everything from the logistics of mentorship to servanthood inside of worship, to self-consciousness inside of worship, and what the solution is for that. Brandon also tells us about his new initiative called the worship life Institute, which is an online course and community that he is developing to help worship leaders not only develop their craft but to help them in studying the deeper aspects of worship. So stay tuned. I know you're going to love this conversation today with Brandon Robertson. Hey everybody, thank you so much again for joining us today. I am Alexis B settee and you are listening to that makes total sense. We have got a really fantastic guest for you today. His name is Brandon Roberson. Hey Brandon.
Speaker 1 02:20 Hey Alexis, how are you? What an honor to be on your show today.
Speaker 0 02:25 Thank you so, so much for coming on. So Brandon and I met a few months ago and because he is a globe Trotter, it has taken just a couple of minutes to get us scheduled today. And we were just talking about the weather in Phoenix where he now lives, but Brandon, what was the most recent trip you just came off of?
Speaker 1 02:48 Um, well last week I was in South Africa.
Speaker 0 02:52 Just last week.
Speaker 1 02:53 Yeah. It's amazing what a plane can do and, but, but just to be able to travel to the various nations and um, and see what God is doing, I'm always just amazed at what's happening and to, and and to see the hunger level for or guy just around the world is absolutely something. So it's, it's definitely something. So yeah, I was in South Africa last week for a conference that lasts about a week and then came back to the States. And right when I landed was a, I had a servers in Chicago and came home and yeah, so it's been busy.
Speaker 0 03:28 That is busy. And you're back at home in Phoenix. So before we jump into that, cause you've already said something that sparked my interest and I think the interest of the people listening, which is the hunger hunger that people have. So before we get into that, um, can you just tell us like a little bit about you, your family, and, um, and what you do. Why are you traveling the world? What are you doing when you're, when you're out and about?
Speaker 1 03:54 Sure, absolutely. Well, as Alexis shared, I'm praying to Rover sin. I am married to my beautiful wife of own. We're going on 13 years now. Uh, Kelly Roberson. And it has been just an amazing journey. Um, our lives together. We have three children. We have Brandon, the second Isaiah and Danielle. And you know, I think God just really knows how to, how to make family work because this is such as you kind of show, there's such a unique dynamic, um, that I have and, uh, traveling and, and just sharing the good news and the gospel through word and worship. And so, um, to be able to have a family that understands that assignment is absolutely just paramount to, uh, to what I've been able to do. So I'm just grateful for them. And, um, yeah, this is, this is just an exciting season and an exciting journey to be on. God is just really up to something. That's what I would say.
Speaker 0 04:47 I love it. I love it. So Brandon and I met a few months ago, like I said, when he was playing keys for Paul Wilbur. And so we were actually just talking before we started recording that, um, I had the opportunity to interview Nathan for the podcast and his episodes dropped in December. So go back and hear those. Nathan and Brennan are good friends and they were both, just, bless me so much to, to have them on the podcast. But what was so crazy to me is that I'll have to tell you when, when we were at this service where Paul was playing and you were there on keys, I have to tell you, I had just come off of seeing Bishop TD Jakes for the first time in person ever. And so we were at Lakewood and the Bishop was there preaching and he brought his own organ player, like the Bishop, like I had the first time I had ever seen that probably was, um, we saw Joseph Garlington earlier in the summer.
Speaker 0 05:52 Oh, I cannot, that's a whole other, I mean that's a whole other topic. I can't even say. He's amazing. He's amazing. But he brought his own keys player and then the Bishop bowl, both bishops, the Bishop Jakes, Bri, his own keys player to Lakewood, his organ player I think, and this is what I thought, I looked over to my husband said that I kinda, I kind of elbowed in him and I'm like, did Paul Wilbur bring his own organ player? Did Paul Wilbur bring his own keys player? Like I'm like, I've heard Paul, I mean, any book can preach, that's for sure. But, but does Paul, does he travel with the, with the keys player like the Bishop? I was so thrown off by that, like you have no idea because for those of you who don't know, like when Paul travels often, um, when he's doing like church cycles and stuff like that, he doesn't bring a full band.
Speaker 0 06:49 It's usually like a track with him and an acoustic guitar. And so when I saw it keys player, I thought, Oh snap, here we go. Like this is it. Paul's about to bring it. Paul's about to preach tonight. So when I saw, when I saw you Brandon, that's, that's the first thought I had was coming straight off of seeing two bishops over the summer. And then here it was Paul and I thought, okay, this is it. I mean, you know what, if you're going to do it, do it, but you, you didn't exactly play like that. I mean, you accompanied Paul,
Speaker 1 07:25 right, right. The funny thing about us, so Paul is actually my, my mentor. And so, um, our schedule is absolutely so crazy when ever, whenever there's a open date on my book or whatever, they've been, who as you mentioned that, and I was like, my brother, he'll call and he's like, Hey bro, can you, you know, can you, you know, come hang with dad or whatever day. And I'm like, Oh yeah, it's, you know, if it works out. And so, you know, with him being my mentor, and it's so funny because I, I don't play for anybody. Like really, he's the only person I go out. And it's just because we flow well together. It's like I don't play it, I don't play it at my church. I, we have, we have a band in a, you know, for professionals and all that for that kind of deal.
Speaker 1 08:06 But he, him and I just shared this, this prophetic chemistry together and forced the, the, you know, the Elijah, Elijah or deal happening. And so, you know, I, it's, it's more of a, it's more of a gleaning when we go out more so than a, um, you know, let me just play him well, cause he's always said, he's like Ryan and you're, you're, you, we're, we're in teamwork together. It's a team ministry. And so, yeah. So it, and it's always on me because he kinda, he says he uses me as a secret weapon sometimes. Just people. I think people are kind of like, okay, who's that guy playing? And he's like, all right, let me start all over the service. That right.
Speaker 0 08:47 Can we talk about when he turned the service over to you? Because I have to tell you, I'm super embarrassed. I have hunted everywhere. I don't know what song you did that day. You probably don't remember. You slept since then. But because I had never seen you in person and I, I just thought for it cause I really thought, who is this guy here? You're right. Paul's right. You are a secret weapon. There's no doubt about it. But he, he turned the service over to you and I was blown away. I just felt, I just felt the presence of God fall. Like I said, I have hunted. I'm like, I cannot find this song. I don't even know what it was that you played. And really, I guess in all honesty, it doesn't really matter that much. Um, because I think it was an original, I think it was an original move was not an instrumental, which I know you've done some of, but it was, the lyrics were beautiful.
Speaker 0 09:44 The presence of God was there and I really did. I thought, okay, this is it. Like this guy's the real deal. You know, like this, this guy's the real deal. So, um, so Paul is a mentor of yours, but you have Ben, you've been all over the world. You go all over the States and you're not just kind of in this genre that Paul is in. He's kind of in this like, um, you know, messianic, uh, style. A lot of his audiences kind of in that, in that scope. But you play and, and Paul for sure, it plays for a lot of, a lot of other churches and stuff too. But I feel like you, you, your style and your ministry, you really, your ministry span, um, all of these different areas inside of the kingdom. I don't even know how to put it, but can you talk a little bit about that and like what is, what is the vision that God has given you for your ministry and how do you feel like that plays out in like a unifying of the kingdom or like a one new man or, you know, however you want to say that this unifying work in the kingdom, I feel like God is doing
Speaker 1 11:02 absolutely. You know what's always interesting is, um, I feel like God, when he gives you something, it's like he gives you a gift and he allows you to unwrap this gift and to just go over more, discover more about it and what he wants you to do. And so I know for me, my heart has always been, um, and I know this word was used very, very freely and almost loosely in the early two thousands a lot where people were saying, Oh, we want, you know, a multicultural church or we want this with one band. And so, you know, my heart has always just been, um, one-to-one to reach everyone. And so, you know, I honestly, it's big. You know, I want to be sure I phrase it right cause I don't want it to sound like, Oh, he's got it together. Cause I really don't.
Speaker 1 11:47 But I, but I, it's always has been my heart to want to reach more than one genre of people. And it's something I teach worship leaders in classes when I teach, you know, knowing how to go in and to discern atmospheres. Um, because one thing that I believe that is placed in me is just how to be able to go in and discern, okay, this is an atmosphere where maybe the prophetic is, is more heavy and you can flow in that. Or this is an atmosphere where, um, they're not quite ready for that, but you know, you can release certain phrases that bring the people into my presence. So just really being able to know how to navigate, uh, various environments I think is just so, so crucial in terms of being able to build the kingdom framework to where when people see me, minister, they don't look at me as, you know, as somebody would say, uh, and we can, you know, just be very blinding Russo.
Speaker 1 12:40 He's cause he's African, African American, we think, Oh, he only does gospel. You know, that's just some of the stereotypes. But I believe when God releases a sound in you and he puts something in you is for all generations, is for all people and breaks down barriers. And it was just really, really releases a kingdom, a sound and an authenticity and to the body of Christ. And so I just really believe that that's what, um, what God has placed in my heart and when it comes to wanting to share and wanting to build a body. Uh, I hope that makes sense.
Speaker 0 13:10 No, it's so good. And I'm just thinking about like when you were saying to, to just pray and ask God to help you understand the atmosphere and to, you know, of what, what is in the room, what kind of people, because I thought it's like Jesus does with each one of us is he just meets us where we are, wants to bring us to him. Right. And so for some people, like you said, like there, for some people it may be a completely prophetic atmosphere. They're waiting, they're wanting a word like that, you know, they're wanting something from God. But for some people and some groups of people that's going to freak them out, you know? And so like if you go in it, that doesn't mean there's anything wrong with the prophetic. But if you go in just like laying out all these words, it, it may distract people because they don't really understand, you know, they're not ready for that yet.
Speaker 0 14:01 And so you give them something else, you ask God what they need. Oh my goodness. Yeah. That like resonates with me so deeply because I just think of my own faith walk and the different, you know, stages that God has brought me through. I'm like, there have been some times when I thought some stuff that I'm ready for now and I'm hungry for now would have totally thrown me off course 20 years ago. But that doesn't mean it's not good and it's not from God. I just wasn't ready for it and I just wasn't in that place. Right.
Speaker 1 14:36 Absolutely. Absolutely. And I believe that there's definitely something Mimi said about that because there are, like you said, there are stages that people are at in that. And I believe that we just have to be very sensitive to that. And so that's why I'm just, you know, as, as we've kind of talked a little bit about, very appreciative the relationship that I have with, um, you know, someone like Paul Wilbur who, uh, when I first heard his music, I believe it was what really kind of gave me this, um, further longing for this deeper prophetic worship. Um, and this, and this sound and this sound. I didn't know him at the time and didn't even realize in the early nineties, I was seeing his music. I didn't realize it until maybe almost 20 years later that we were singing his, his songs. But I said, the guy who said I heard the song where to be, but he and I wound up recording, um, Becca 2013 together. And I said, I could ever meet this man. I'm like, I just, I need somebody like that in my life. And so for a guy just to open up this crazy door for that to happen, and then for me to be able to glean from somebody, you know, with such an international, uh, global, uh, perspective on, on worship and influence and all that, I mean, it's really just been amazing this journey over the past few years.
Speaker 0 15:52 Oh my goodness. That's like, do you want to tell a story? I mean, I'm like, I don't, I don't feel, I'm like, we're having brain Anom. We've talked about Paul so much. Maybe Paula, come on at some point. I don't know. But I'm like, but I'm like, but, but I just, I feel like that speaks to so many people who are in ministry right now or who are starting off in ministry. And maybe they have that crazy idea of like, Oh my goodness, if I could learn from this person or if I could meet this person in, and I'm not saying you tell the story and this is going to happen, everybody, but what inning? But what an encouragement, you know, because God knows what we need. And I think he puts those desires inside of our hearts and waiting, you know, like we pray for that. And so I think if you want to share even a little bit of that, I think we'd be interested because I'm like, you're, your ministry is so global and international and all of those things. And to kind of hear how Paul has influenced you and mentored you in that way, that'd be great.
Speaker 1 16:49 Absolutely. So, um, as I, as I, I believe in, you know, just to kind of preface this story, I definitely believe in the power of a generational transfer. Um, when you look at stories like, um, Elijah and Elijah and you see, um, how of the, uh, how Elijah went after, what, what he saw on, on the man of God. He said, look, I've got all this history with my family behind me and, and you know, and he's done very well for himself, but he said, this is my, my past. This man contains my destiny. He has something in him that I need for where God has taken me. And so identify that, uh, just interestingly enough and Impala the all those years ago. And so we were actually funny enough, currently we were at the church that I'm still currently serving at in Chicago. And so, um, he, uh, he was there and he was ministering.
Speaker 1 17:43 And afterward one of the keyboard players, this was maybe 2008, um, keyboard player came to. So why do you want to, do you want to meet Paul? And I was like, sure. You know, like, okay, I was just going to work. Okay, fine. And so, uh, he was, he was standing in the doorway of the office area and he just said, Hey, Paul, I was just wanna introduce you to, you know, a friend of mine was Brandon. And he said, okay, great. And before I even knew it, I just, you know, I was shaking his hand and I said, wow. I said, I'm just, that's a blessing to meet you. And I just blurted out, would you mentor me? And yeah, so it was like, no, no, you know, break and the counter. And I was like, now if you let Paul tell the story, he has a different story.
Speaker 1 18:29 But I'd tell him, he's like, he thinks my wife was involved or something that makes, I said, no, I remember how the story went. And so, um, and so when I said it, it was almost one of those things like, Oh God, what did you say? And he's just set yourself up for rejection. Like, Oh yeah, yeah. And so I just stood there and he looked at me and he kind of has this gaze where he's like, you know, kind of, you know, kind of a prophetic says like hearing what God is saying. And so he kind of looked at me and he just shook his head and he said, he said, okay. He said, let's, let's see where this go. Then funny enough, we, he, we happened to have a, um, mutual, uh, person in ministry that we both knew and had been close with at one point.
Speaker 1 19:13 And so he was, he was very intrigued at FAA, said, okay. He said, let's let, let's see. So we gave him was exchanged phone numbers and email address or whatever. And I said, okay, well, let's see where it goes. And so, uh, maybe a month or two later, we finally got a chance to talk on the phone and just share. And, and from then it just opened up. And a couple of years later, um, I had gone through a couple of, um, transitions in life and whatnot. And so he, uh, really was instrumental in the walking me through that. And I told him, I said, you know, I really feel this burden for the nations and really feel like I, you know, I feel like I want to express and share what God has put in me. And he said, uh, he said, well, he said, why don't you just kinda, he said, maybe it'll be good if you go out on the road with me just a little bit, just so you can have a picture of what this looks like.
Speaker 1 20:00 And so he brought me down with their offices and Jackson build and we spent a couple of days together and, which was like, ask whatever you want to ask and let's just, yeah, let's just, he just poured into me. I even took a picture and I was sitting across from his office desk, he's working on emails or whatever. And whenever I thought of something, it's like, ask it and let's go. So it was an amazing time. And so from there, again, that was a decade ago. Now from there we started to traveling in and I mean, I've literally literally been all over the world. And that is what kind of gave the picture for me starting to travel to nations and then that opened up other doors. And from there it's just been, it's been one thing after another, but I've just really been amazed at God for, for the, um, for the amazing, uh, picture that he gave me for that download.
Speaker 0 20:48 And now to be able to kind of walk that out has been absolutely amazing. Well, let's, let's unpack some of that for a second because how you started off. I'm like in, in my life, I mean I'm hoping this will minister to other people too, but I'm like, am I like, this is like the third time in the past two days where this concept has come in. So, um, I in my like day job, right, I do help people with, with their personal finances and stuff like that. And God has really been talking to me probably over the last two years specifically about legacy, right? Not just being an inheritance, not just being, um, not just being like an inheritance after someone has passed away or, and not even necessarily just being money, but like the spiritual legacy and a spiritual inheritance to say it is good and right, that our kids don't have to start where we started.
Speaker 0 21:43 It's good and right that our kids start like we give them a head start by what God, the work that God has allowed us to do. Right. So actually when I was listening to Nathan's podcast, we talked about that a little bit with his ministry. Um, and how, you know, he doesn't have to start where his dad started. And you know, that's like where we can see this generational thing in, in like at a physical generational, like his actual son. Um, but then Levi Lusko today, I saw some posts that he was doing of like, we'll tell our kids, look right, we'll tell our kids, I built this building so you don't have to, I did this. You don't have to. I did this. You don't have to. Um, because it's not, so they don't have to do anything though. It's so they don't have to do the work we did.
Speaker 0 22:34 I built this building, now you go right, this wasn't Levi's. But you know, it's like now you go fill it right now you go, you build something on top of it, you, you know, you go do that. And then here you are saying the same thing. It's like this, this biblical legacy, this generational thing, this ministry thing, this Elijah Elisha thing. And I mean, I guess talk to us about what that looks like as somebody who is currently on the receiving end. And then, you know, my friend, my friend likes to tell me that it's like, we kind of picture ourselves as a brick and then we have like two bricks on top of us, you know, they're staggered and then two bricks under us, right? So we're, we're, we're getting something from the top and then we're, we're able to, you know, we're, we're supporting and we're able to pour out too. So you're currently receiving, probably not just from Paul, but from a lot of people in your life in ministry, and then in this part in your, in your career, in ministry. How are you seeing that, where you're pouring into the people that are coming after you? Wow, that's powerful
Speaker 1 23:46 question and statement altogether. Um, I, I believe as an, as I mentioned moments ago, when we talk about generational transfer, I believe that there has to be, um, the understanding from my particular generation, which you know, can range anywhere between thirties and forties. Um, of the fact that there are people that have gone before us that carry a weight of God's glory, that is, that is still needed in the earth. Um, and there has to be a way for us, I want to be sure I word this right, but it has to be a way for us to, um, bring those generations together for, uh, the advancement of the kingdom. Um, you know, for instance, sometimes people feel as though, Oh, um, because I'm, I'll use this as an example because they created music in the 1920s that is not relevant for today anymore. You know, because, uh, because we've got a new sound, God has got us doing a new thing.
Speaker 1 24:51 Well, yes, that is true. Um, there are still, um, measures of his, of his glory and measures of his presence that are, that are released. And, and, and I'm using music as an example, uh, through, through timeless music that needs to resonate with what God is doing in today's and in today's or of in what he's doing right now in the kingdom. Um, so it's not a matter of doing away with, you know, an ad. Cause I realize the podcast is about, it's a lot of people. And so I just want to be sensitive how I'm saying it. Cause sometimes people feel like, Oh, you know, because generations are getting older and people are moving on and that's all irrelevant. No, there, there are measures of glory that my generation hasn't been able to access because we have not. Um, uh, submitted to those that have gone before us for, for instance, um, my, my pastor, as you said, uh, he, and he's, he's my spiritual father.
Speaker 1 25:50 He's, he's gone. But dr bill Winston, he's gone before us and he's done amazing thing. I mean, just huge and still doing even now, huge things for the, for the body of Christ. And me as, as a son, you know, I see what I see, what the father has done and I am able to read those benefits because of, of what he's done. But he, but there's one of those things where it's not like he's expecting me to do exactly what he's done, but he as a father, fathers pour into their son so that they go further. They brought, but they're still carrying, they still carry the mantle, you know? Oh, so much. I want to say right now there, there are certain mantles that are released when you submit to God's divine order. There are certain, uh, there are certain things that you can experience without some meetings of guys to buy an order.
Speaker 1 26:42 And so he's people in out there. He's put the spiritual fathers and are in our lives in order to, in order to release those mantles that are still needed here in the earth. And um, you know, I don't want to date the podcast, but as a recently, you know, we've had a general transition, you know, um, okay. Reinhardt Bunky and some others. I have recently gone on to be with the Lord though those, those mantles that they left for evangelism and for Apple systolic word. And those things are here in the earth for us to pick up and to continue on and to take to the next level because there are people, there are people here that need that in Europe. There are people here that are, that are longing. I say when I goes to the nations, I see these people that are just hungry for more of God. And so, you know, there are those that have to realize what God is doing, be sensitive to what he's saying in the earth and be ready to, to grab the mantle and continue to move on, um, with the kingdom assignment to help them make sense.
Speaker 0 27:38 No, it's, it's good. It's good. And I feel like I just want to, I just want to add to it. Cause when you said, um, I mean there's nothing really to add to it. It was great. But when you said, um, you know, you don't have to do the same thing, right. But it's like, it's like I just keep thinking we're all in the family business, right? Like we're all in the family business. We're all in this kingdom business. And the mantle, if, you know, if I'm understanding correctly, you may pick up this mantle, but God has given you your gifts and your assignments but you, but you need this blessing, this gifting, this, this mantle, this thing to carry forward. But you know, you hear those stories all the time in like the business world, for example, the corporate world where, you know, the son comes along and he introduces some sort of new technology or something that takes a family business, you know, millions and millions of dollars ahead of where father was able to take it because they're doing the same business.
Speaker 0 28:39 But he introduced something that he was gifted at. And you know, I just think that I can see that with what you're talking about. It's like we pick up those things, but God has gifted us and so we get to, we get to start where they are leaving off and continue, which is true for those who've gone on like you're talking about, but for those who are still here, I mean we get to, it's that old example, right? For all, for all of us old school track people, right? It's that, that period of time when you're running with the Baton together, right. That's like so important because they are finishing as hard as they can. That's the, that's probably the most intense part of their race, you know, is that, is that handoff and then in a way it's the most intense part of our race too, is that handoff. You know, there's the nerves, there's the starting, there's the picking up speed, but they're not slowing down until after that Baton has already passed. You know, they're, they're not, they don't just come to a complete stop and say, Oh, here you go. You're going to, you do it that way. You have to run together. And I think that it is as people our age that are in that unique position right now on the earth and in the kingdom who get to, who get to run alongside these.
Speaker 1 29:58 Yeah, absolutely. And I love how you said that and I think that's so, that's so key, especially in the kingdom of God. We still have to be authentic to who we are, who we are. But I love how you say that it's, it's, it's taking what they, what they have given in, in having your unique expression with it and then continuing until you win for, um, and I've seen it so many times and like we've used this example with Paul over here on this podcast and when I grow up, when I've gone out with him sometimes he's like, no, Brandon, why don't you go ahead and read wholly worthy of those songs are like my, my GoTo songs. I mean my, my private worship SOLs and you know, we were sacking, remember where we were couple of months ago and rammed us to say to me, those are like the, the granddaddy hits as a Ram.
Speaker 1 30:47 They say you go ahead and lead that and he just, you know, he, he's just playing and just, you know, just supporting it. To me it just, it speaks so much and then, you know, an hour I'll, uh, I'll give my own unique expression to out to how I lead it or whatever, which she just, um, has, has embraced that. So for me that, that just really speaks to the love of fathering and mentoring and all of that expression put together on for those, uh, like we mentioned, like I said at the beginning of the broadcast and maybe saying that I want somebody like that, you know, in my life, and maybe it's not Paul, maybe somebody else you've been, you know, I, um, there, you do have to be sure that one of the deals with having a mentor, mentee relationship, you do have to go after it.
Speaker 1 31:33 You know, there is some, some, some measure of work that you have to do as well and don't take, you know, the first no as or the first yes. As, okay. That's it. You know, I'm, I'm sitting back waiting on them through the word no, you have to pursue and you have to go after what it is that, that you believe they got us put in their life that you need for your life. Right. So, and that's what any mentor, mentee relationship, I've been privileged to mentor. Um, this kind of answers the other part of your question. I've been privileged to mentor some, uh, some younger worship leaders who are coming up by me and they're like, man, we love what we see you do. You know, how can we get to that? You know, but they're, but they're asking me, you know, they don't let me miss appointments.
Speaker 1 32:16 They're like, all right, what time are we meeting? What time are we, you know, cause I, I need to, I need to get it, I need to hear it. And, um, you know, so that's just kinda how God has been goddess and building things. And so, uh, something else that we've been passionate about here over this past year was just equipping worship leaders. Uh, we've started, we've launched a online, uh, worship instance. We've got worship life online, um, or supply being institutes. And so, uh, one of our e-courses, funny enough, is with me and Paul and it's one of the things that we've, um, that we've done where we just teach on a depth of worship and over the next six months or so, we're going to be launching a whole lot of things on that platform. Um, but it's just really helping with more troopers and helping queer creatives and worship leaders just to really understand the magnitude, uh, and the depth of what we are as worshipers in the earth.
Speaker 0 33:04 Wow. That sounds incredible.
Speaker 1 33:06 Oh yeah. I'm excited. I'm excited about it. I'm excited about it.
Speaker 0 33:10 But do, I mean, I'm sure you, this is like, this is kind of a Doug question I feel like, but I'm like, you're, you're launching something like that, but I feel okay. It's hard for me to tell with me if it's like I'm, God is just now waking me up to certain things that he's doing or if it's like he's actually starting to do a new wave of something. Right. So like one of them, you know, we touched on a little bit is kind of this unifying kingdom work, but one of them is, I think you phrased it, I wouldn't have phrased it that way, but I'm glad you did because now I can use it, but the depth of worship, right? Like big depth of worship because um, my husband and I have been serving on worship teams for, Oh, I don't know, in the neighborhood of 17 years or something crazy like that.
Speaker 0 33:55 And um, neither one of us have ever led like been the actual worship leader. Neither one of us have a dynamic enough voice for that to be completely honest. But I feel like in the past, maybe, maybe in the church or maybe it's just been like my eyes haven't been open to it, but it's like worship in the past. It's like worship equals music, you know? And then like, when you say the depth of worship, I'm like, Oh, but I think God is doing something. He's revealing something. Or maybe it's just me, but he's revealing something to us as a, as citizens of his kingdom that worship. It's not like worship equal sign music. Right? It's like there's, he's bringing to our attention. I feel like this aspect of adoration, right? This aspect of excellence inside what we're doing. Um, this, there's a work aspect to it too. Right. So, um, what, what do you see as being this depth of worship that, that you're able to help impart to younger, um, you know, people who are just now coming up, maybe not that they're not physical, younger, but maybe they're just younger in, in their worship experience, but what do you feel like the depth of worship is that you guys are seeing God start to reveal? And then how are you imparting that to others?
Speaker 1 35:16 Sure. It's, it's really realizing that our life of worship is a life of his presence. I mean, that's, that's really where, um, what would it boils down to? It's funny because typically when I teach, um, music ministries or whatever, uh, one of the first things we we deal with is, is the myth. Praise and worship. Praise means upbeat song and worship means a slow song.
Speaker 0 35:41 Right? Right, right. Yeah.
Speaker 1 35:43 And, and as, and, and that's where people would typically get stuck at. It's like, okay, we're gonna have some worship. And it's like people were looking around like, where's the, where's the music? Where's the, where's the violin? But, but realizing that worship really has to do with who we are as a people, how we, how we serve, how we, um, how we care for one another. All of these things equal a lifestyle. Abortion surrounded, I'm surrounded by his presence, uh, in, in one of the biggest things that I teach people, especially those in leadership or those that serve in music or creative arts, is that our biggest, our biggest expression of worship is how we serve, how we serve one another and how we serve the body of Christ. Hey, hands down, I, there was a couple of scriptures, I always kind of uses my go tos.
Speaker 1 36:30 Um, it's in Luke 2227 four, who was greater. He who sits at the table or he who served is in a knacky who sits at the table. Yet I am among you as the one who serves as what she's the Saint Mark. 10 45, or even the son of man did not come to be served, but to serve and to give his life as a ransom for many. And even first Peter four 10 through 11, as each has received a gift, use it to serve one another as good stewards of God, of God's very grace. Whoever speaks as one who speaks Oracles of God, whoever serves as one who serves by the strength that God supplies in order that in everything God may be glorified through Jesus Christ to him belong glory and dominion forever and ever. Amen. And so, I mean, there are more scriptures I could definitely share about, you know, the heart of serving.
Speaker 1 37:19 But I do believe that that is a, and that's a, that's a big piece in us understanding. I mean there's so many levels that that would, we we'd go away, passes by again, all of it. Um, all the levels of absurd. But I do believe that I'm, that we're in a generation now to where our life is, is, is marked by the presence of God, our, our worship. Uh, it comes from, uh, our expression. It comes from our, our life of being marked by his presence. So I, I believe that's the generation we're in now and I believe we're going to see the miracle signs and wonders that we're wanting to see out of the overflow of understanding who we are as worshipers.
Speaker 0 37:57 Oh, that's so good. That is just, that's so good. We were at a, um, a prophetic conference at the beginning of the summer, um, with a guy named Shawn Bolz. I don't know. Um, but he did this three day prophetic conference in Dallas and it was, it was out of this world. And, um, I'll tell you how big the rock is that I've been under the last several years is I did not know who Rick Pinot was. Like, I had no idea. And so we get there and kind of looking through the program and um, you know, I mean there were some people there like, um, Brian and Katie tour wat were there for, uh, for a little session and then we had, um, upper room Dallas was there, um, for some sessions and Rick Pino was there for some sessions and I became completely obsessed with Rick Pinos worship music, like completely obsessed. Like it was really, really stupid.
Speaker 0 39:05 Like I made it really, really one album in particular I just became completely obsessed with. But, um, I, when I was there, when you're talking about the presence of what made me think of it was, yeah, it was one of these crazy things and I'm like, uh, people just like stay tuned, but I'm like, I felt like I'm not a crazy person, but this was one of the first times in my life where I had no idea what was happening until finally the spirit of God told me through me. Like overhearing someone else talking about it, they're talking about the presence of God means so heavy. And I'm like, Oh, that's what I'm feeling. Like I was <inaudible> feeling in my body something that I had never experienced before. At least not that big for that long. And I was like, Oh dear, that's what this is.
Speaker 0 40:01 Like Zack is the presence of God. Like that's, that's one of the ways his presence is manifesting right now is I can physically feel it. I mean, you guys can see it. Brandon's ramen is nodding his head. He does not think I'm crazy. I know maybe that have some listeners who think I'm crazy. It's okay. You can fast forward through this part. Is there a little bit 30 seconds just fast forward it. But Brandon is not thinking I'm crazy. Brandon is nodding his head like maybe he has experienced this before, but um, it's, but it is, I think, I think you're right. I mean you, you have seen this in so many more places than, than I have. But just like, I even love that idea of being a generation marked by experiencing God's presence. Like you're saying like that's what, that's what worship is about. It's about, it's about serving. I mean, somebody recently prayed in this session where I was and he said, God, help us to serve because we are no more like you than when we serve. And I thought, Oh, that's going to stick with me for a long time. But it's true. We're, we're, no, we, we were, can be any more like him than when we're serving. And, and then to be blessed with his, with his presence, just being able to feel his presence. It's incredible.
Speaker 1 41:19 Absolutely. I mean, you know, worship, worship costs us something in, in life. Um, and one of the phrases that I stayed by is, you know, the deeper you get into the glory of God, the less it becomes about you.
Speaker 0 41:33 Um,
Speaker 1 41:34 and so a lot of times we placed, uh, the value. You know, we talked about worship costing as something, a lot of times when we've placed the value on our comfort, um, especially when it comes to experiencing worship the way we've always experienced it, which is why, I love what you're saying because you know, when you get into different environments, sometimes you, you hear something new, you guys presence manifest in a different way. Um, and so it's like, you know, uh, when we're in that place of comfort, it's like, okay, I know how this all makes me feel when I worship. I know how this, you know, I know what this cord does when I hear it from my worship time, you know, but when we step outside of ourselves and do with the realities that God is multidimensional and we operate different realms and there are places in him, even as far as we will have gone in the weakness of his glory, that there's always still more.
Speaker 1 42:30 It's realizing that, that our worship is worth w O R T H to God. Uh, it's a place where we always just remain Tinder harder to who he is. Having that childlike heart, um, to say, okay, bad, I know that there's more to you. My heart is open and I'm ready to experience more. Uh, I believe that and when we're building an altar of worship before God, you know, whether it's corporately, whether it's in our private time, we are to leave change. There ought to be some sense of measurable change in our, in our times on worship, in our prayer time. You know, I would say in order to say it before, if we only out of our prayer time change with God, then we just complained the whole time. We just have to say, you might have to say that again. We just, we just added a dumping session.
Speaker 1 43:23 We are leaving, we are leaving change with measurable results, you know, to, to to who we are is in individuals. You know, if I, if I have a, if I have a mean characteristics I had to meet when I leave the prednisone guy out to leave tenderhearted and nice and sweet and you know, the, those type of things. So, um, yeah, you know, we, we've got to, there's so much to be said. I don't want to take a bet I get going on and on, but I just, um, I definitely feel that, that we've got to move past, um, feeling comfortable treating Jesus like a house guest and realize that that we have a divine invitation to draw close to him. He's invited us to dwell with them. He's invited us to come closer to some no HIPAA, the kindness of his heart to understand who he is.
Speaker 1 44:13 We've been invited to the table as worshipers, as believers to hear what God is saying. And so I believe in it's how we're going to get the downloads. I believe that's how we're going to experience more of the supernatural, how we will truly experience, um, times of worship where we leave, we're fresh and we get into that river. We get into that place to where it's like we experienced those things that, that, that we haven't seen. The earth is waiting for us. The earth is waiting for those. Those of you that listen to this podcast now, the earth is waiting on you and what you have to offer to jump in that river.
Speaker 0 44:45 Oh my goodness. I'm like, I'm like tearing up right now, guys. This is so good. This is so good. I feel like I have one last question that just hit me. Do you feel like this is, this is loaded Brandon, just a warning. This is low, but when you were just talking about how we, he's invited us to come so close, right? And I think, I don't think it's just me, but I think for a lot of us <inaudible> this closeness, whether it's with people or or with the Lord, there is an element of self consciousness that keeps us from the intimacy, whether it's with the people in our lives or in this case, specifically with the Lord. Do you think that there is a level of self consciousness with us as worshipers and as individual worshipers that is kind of blocking us from, from entering in to that dwelling place with God to the degree that he would want us to.
Speaker 0 45:55 Right. There is something that, you know, I'm just gonna, I'm just gonna say it because it's like, you know, when you go to give somebody a hug and you're like, ma, is that smell me? Like, you know, should I like, you know, and are they gonna want to hug me? Are they going to want to embrace me? Are they going to Wendy this? Because, because I might not, you know, there's something about me, but it's like, I think that we still don't as worshipers don't understand. God isn't afraid of that or he's not grossed out by that.
Speaker 1 46:24 Yeah. He's not in. And that's where we have to the, the word right. When you started, um, saying that the saying the statement and the question, the word that just kept ringing into my spirit was, we have to understand that we are the righteousness of God. Um, and we have to understand that what Jesus did for us is enough for us to have access to the place of God or go to the place God is wanting to take us to. I mean, and I get it cause I deal with it more times and then I then I can count where people have come to me and they said, you know, I just, I just feel like I can't lead worship anymore because of this or I can't, you know, because I'm carrying such weight, carrying a such deal. Um, we have to realize that, you know, not want to just, I want to just be sure I'm phrasing this right.
Speaker 1 47:16 Again, we are the righteousness of God. Our job is to continually seek first the kingdom of God. Um, and the moment we turn our attention away from seeking the kingdom and we get off into all of the other tiers of the world, all of the, the things that we are personally dealing with, um, is, is when, is when our influence begins to dwindle. We have to realize that God has placed something inside. It was, we're not perfect. We are, we are people, but he desires to sit through all of that stuff. You know, I was say as he left the 99 to go after the one always, he'd always go on after you. He, he's always got you in his heart. So we have to not allow the cares of this world to, um, to, to take us or to consume us so much to where we forget that we are his righteousness.
Speaker 1 48:05 I mean it's, it's, you know, he's given us such grace and mercy and he wants his glory to, to resound through us. He wants to give us his glory. One thing that just popped in my mind, I wanted to look it up here, um, where it talks about the glory of God who says, I am the Lord. That his mind is Isaiah 42, eight through 10. I am the Lord and that is my name and my glory. Will I not give to another, um, you know, and sort of clarify that, uh, you know, so cause some people say, Oh God doesn't, you know, he doesn't share his glory and that type. So, uh, the glory here is a represent those that are not in Christ because God does release his glory over his children. That's according to Romans eight 17. Then you have children, then heirs in a bears with God and joint heirs with Christ.
Speaker 1 48:50 And if indeed we suffer with him, that we may also be glorified together. So you can't release the glory of God into an atmosphere without it, without flowing from the glory of God. You, you can't release glory without glory being in your life. Um, and so when he says, my blurry will, I'm not sure with another, you aren't the another, you are his child. So, uh, neither phrase givens, a graven image, behold the form of things are coming to pass and the new things do. I declare, I believe that God is doing new things in us and I, and I just want to prophesied over anybody that they may be feeling like, you know, they are dealing with, um, of eating, whether it's thoughts of rejection, whether it's feeling like, you know, you're never good enough to come into the presence of God because of things that you've done.
Speaker 1 49:34 Because of things of your past because of the weightiness of what you may have even done just last night. You're like, Oh, I know. I'm not worried that if the enemy can keep us in that place, if he can keep us in that thought process of, of holding onto all the things that we'd done and our, in our past will never answer until the new, into the new place that God has for us. But we have to keep pressing. We have to realize that we are his righteousness and um, realize that as worshipers, he's always gotten more for us as we're suburbs. He's always call on this higher. So I hope that kind of <inaudible> say it's on some though, but kind of hate somewhere in there to where you were.
Speaker 0 50:09 No, I'm ready. I'm ready just to S I'm ready just to stop. Like I can turn my mic off and you can go and you could just keep going because it's because it's so good. You know, I just, I'm, I'm loving it. I was thinking, I was thinking, okay, I've got one last question for you and then you answered it. Which is, you know what, what would you tell us to encourage us in our worship? And you just, and you just nailed it. You just nailed it. But I'm gonna let you have another chance and say if you want to add anything to that, because I, I just, I knew that you were great at this, but I did not fully anticipate we were going to worship class today. But I'm here, I'm here for it, I'm here for it. And I really believe that this is what, that God's here for it.
Speaker 0 50:55 So we're, where are your, where are your students? And you have a, have a couple of minutes to tell us. And, and I'm not saying there's, this is not, you know, this is not Alexis. The bass player likes is the vocalist. This is not somebody out there who's the worship leader necessarily. But this is just us. You know, one of the things I've been experiencing lately is just really trying to make more of a point in the last few years of having this private time intimate worship time with just me and God. I think corporate worship is amazing, but I'm discovering so much about God just getting alone with him. And I'm telling you, it's not anything technical. It's usually me and my YouTube page, you know? And, and that's something anybody can do, but, but what would you tell us, like as worshipers, as students of God's presence, if that's a way we can be, what would you tell us as somebody who's been doing this for a long time? What's like one thing that you would leave us with? How do we enter in more,
Speaker 1 52:04 you know, I, I w I would say to, to stay hungry and I, it goes back to the first thing that we kind of said at the start of this podcast. Um, to stay hungry. I think one of the most dangerous things that we can, uh, encounter as, um, lovers of God and especially those who, uh, have learned how to enter into the presence of God is being so comfortable with the presence of God that we don't, um, that we don't push for, for more. Um, I teach a Sigma sometimes is kind of dealing with those who love to worship, worship, meaning we love the, we love the environment and worship, you know, how it creating all that kind of stuff. It's like, Oh, we know how to give him, but what are we more into the D dazzle and they know the environment or the person who it's about.
Speaker 1 52:55 And so, you know, I believe that we, we have to say so tender hearted and so chow, like harder to where we always realize there's more and to stay and to stay hungry into not become so comfortable, uh, with, with the way things have always been or what we know, the magnitude of worship to be, but to always keep pressing, keep studying, keep, keep listening for God. Keep, um, you know, I mean some of these resources out here are great, you know, where they have YouTube channels with expressions of, of, of, you know, people going after God and different things, you know, but it's personal. It's a relationship that we have to have. And so I just believe that, um, we just got to stay hungry. I think that that's what I would, that's what I would sum summarize at the end.
Speaker 0 53:41 Amen. Amen. Thank you so much Brandon. This has been a conversation that I didn't even know I needed, so I hope it is.
Speaker 1 53:52 Yeah, I didn't know what to expect. I'm like, okay, let me trigger a couple of little notes. Like, well, let me just think here you have something ready just in case she wants to go a certain direction, which you just are some things up to me to data and I'm like, I need to go back and study a little bit more myself.
Speaker 0 54:07 Well, praise God. I think we're there. I'm, I know that we prayed before and I hope that our audience is there as well because there's just, there's just with God, there's just always so much more with him. There's just always so much more. So Branan um, we're coming to a close, but tell us and tell our listeners how they can connect with you.
Speaker 1 54:28 Sure. You can find out more at www dot brand in a row bursts in that or G. um, we've got face to face ministries in a national, you can always email us at info at Brandon Robertson, dad orG and also with what I mentioned about our worship life Institute. Uh, we have a class a eCourse on there now where, um, I did a sit down with Paul Wilbur. We get five plus hours of teaching, um, and it was on understanding the depth of worship. So it's a powerful of course and you can um, check that
[email protected]. So there are tons of ways you can meet you Google me brand rogues out Papa, but I would love to connect with you and stay in touch with you, especially with some of the things we've got coming up on that war supply Institute.
Speaker 0 55:14 Nice. Okay. Thank you so much. And I'll put that in the show notes for this episode. We'll put Brandon represent.org and the worship life institute.com. We'll put the links to both of those on there. And Brandon's also on Facebook and Instagram and you know, all of those great social things. I told him before we started recording that I was getting tired watching his feed because he's traveling lately has been crazy. And I'm like, I'm like, I know if I feel like I'm, I'm, I'm tired. I'll just like, I need a nap. I'll just go to Brandon's stories. And I'm like, okay, I'm worn out. That's good. I can crash now. So it's good. Brandon. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you for being on the show. This has been such a blessing. Thank you so much.
Speaker 1 55:58 Absolutely honored. Look forward to talking with you again soon.
Speaker 0 56:01 Thanks, Brandon. <inaudible>
Speaker 1 56:03 all right, thanks Alexis.
Speaker 0 56:06 So thank you again so much for listening. Don't forget to subscribe so you won't miss an episode. Share the link with your friends. You can visit us at <inaudible>. That makes total sense.com and until next time, this is Alexis Piseti remembering to do well for ourselves so we can do good for others.
Speaker 2 56:26 <inaudible>.
